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Pandora Screentime Minutes, and Thoughts

*Sign* So, you know, I was really disappointed. I thought this ep was something of a hot mess.

But, everything goes behind the cut to ensure non-spoilage

Type your cut contents here

Boy, those Kandorians and their kneeling.

Anyway, here are the stats, and they should come as much of a surprise to anyone

Running Time: 41m, 39s (previously on: 52s)

Clark: 21m, 55s
Chloe: 11m, 55s
Lois: 32m, 45s
Oliver: 9m, 23s
Tess: 10m, 10s
Zod: 9m, 44s

Emil: 1m, 25s

Year To Date:

Clark: 161m, 1s
Chloe: 65m, 52s
Lois: 154m, 11s (8)
Oliver: 86m, 18s (7)
Tess: 48m, 2s (7)
Zod: 40m, 26s (5)

So, why do I expect that the show is setting Clark up for another "Its all my fault" plot line? Maybe because they love them so much? Whatever, I'm bracing for the worst.

Why would the black shirt with the symbol Lois had never seen before mean anything to her?

How did Zod know Clark's birth name was Kal-El?

How did Zod know Lois had the Legion ring tucked in her pocket?

If Chloe had a virus that would disable the ray from the Tower (and did anyone else get Independence Day flashbacks?), why hadn't she pulled that trigger before?

I though Chloe and Oliver had a whole group of followers. Where were they towards the end?

Clark turned his back on Chloe and Oliver because they reminded him of Lois? Not because one stabbed him in the back symbolically, and the other one did it literally? And Clark is the big asshole for it, obviously, and has pretty much done nothing right? Wow show, you kinda suck for that.

All I know is that the show I watched in S8 did not have Clark, or Lois, in a place where the Clark and Lois in this episode made sense to me. That Clark would feel relief that she was alive? I totally get. That he would die to protect her? Absolutely. This? Not so much. And frankly, I don't think Lois' would be all about having the sex here either. In fact, I was surprised at how unnecessary the sex scene seemed to me. Not to mention the HORRIBLE MONTAGE!! What was that? The leaked scenes were about a million times hotter and more interesting. A montage? Really? That was awful, and it wasn't even well executed.

I continue to loathe Clark/Chloe scenes. They have become incredibly unpleasant to watch.

So, Chloe is pretty much in charge of the whole WT/JLA thing now, right? And everyone is just supposed to do what she says?

I don't get why Tess thought siding with Zod would save the Earth. And now she's just shooting minions in the back?

If Zod was trying to convince Clark to join him, why would he be keeping him at the Kent Farm instead of keeping him closer to him at the mansion?

Why would Alia give a crap about a humans old watch? Is she going to pawn it?

Talk about a big fizzle with the Clark/Alia thing, eh? Why did she apologize to him for failing, and why did she touch his face tenderly in Savior? They apparently had no relationship to speak of. I smell a rewrite.

Why did Alia have her powers when she followed Lois back to the present time? And where did she get Blue Kryptonite? And why would she have to use it? (going back to Savior)

Why did Tess stick things into her head, and not bleed, or have any holes? Lois too, for that matter.

I guess this is another dream link machine invented by Lionel Luthor? The one from Fracture didn't work on kryptonite.

So, Lois lost her memory of the events because it was traumatic? Thats it? Thats the big explanation?

Who directed this ep? .

I'm not a shipper. I've never been a shipper when it comes to SV. And this episode reminds me why I'm not. I just really don't enjoy when a relationship, any relationship, becomes Clark's raison d'etre. Its just not my thing.

Having said that, the final Clois scene at the DP was one of the few in the episode that worked for me. It was very cute, and Tom sold it completely.

I thought the cast was very good, and it was fun seeing everyone get some screentime together. I do continue to lament the lack of meaningful Clark/Tess scenes, but I've pretty much given up hope on them.

I was glad Stuart lived. And I still really like Emil.

So, I guess thats it until January 22..


( 69 comments — Leave a comment )
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Nov. 21st, 2009 06:58 am (UTC)
ITA with just about all your caveats. I kinda liked the episode, but the devil is in the details.

The machine used looked like a combination of the summerholt memory machine used in Lara (with Kara and green K) and the fracture machine. Maybe they were trying to find a way to get rid of the side effects????

FYI, Beggs directed it - his only other episode was Bulletproof - also not the best put together episode.
Nov. 21st, 2009 05:05 pm (UTC)
And Oy, did this episode fail on the details. I was watching it with my sister, and she kept turning me to me and saying "What?"

I don't know, a big episode like this, don't you think they would've given it to one of the more experianced directors? I would've loved to see TW take this one on.
Nov. 21st, 2009 07:11 am (UTC)
//Having said that, the final Clois scene at the DP was one of the few in the episode that worked for me. It was very cute, and Tom sold it completely.//
Couldn't agree more! This was the best scene.

What happened to the rest of the episode? I don't know but i was expecting so much more that I was kind of dissapointed too. I, of course, enjoyed Tom's sexiness.

Tess is really smarter now than the the future Tess!

About the love scene?? Sexy but short...edited and...*shakes head*
Nov. 21st, 2009 05:08 pm (UTC)
I do think this ep suffered from a huge build-up. I suspect the Socigends 2 hour movie might also be set up for the same thing. But I think a lot of people have already written up their glowing reviews for that, no matter what it is.

I just don't care for the writing for Tess with this Zod thing. They gave her absolutely no explanation for her whole "I have to save the Earth" thing with Zod. And then an overly long death scene with a cry facing Oliver? Really? Have they even shared a scene this season?

I don't even know what that love scene montage was, but I think high school students with a home video camera and a computer editing program couldn't done better. Why not just let those scenes unfold? They made a mess out of it.
Nov. 21st, 2009 07:35 am (UTC)
Because of those screentimes, it's clear the first half was Lois-centric. It's the equivalent of last season's second half where it wasn't Clark-centric. The only reason Lois has been emphasized is because they're making it to her for being absent in last season's second half. Also TW's co-exec producer title may also be a factor as well. Since Lois no longer has memories of the future, she has served her purpose in the season's main storyline with Zod. Pandora sums up the Lois emphasis of the first half of the season.
Nov. 21st, 2009 05:10 pm (UTC)
I guess we'll have to see. Lois seems to be their favorite new toy these days. Yes, a lot of that made sense with the whole vision of the future thing. Now, will it change? I guess we'll find out. She's now Clark's girlfriend, and that isn't usually a backseat role, except for Lana in S7.
(no subject) - svfan01 - Nov. 21st, 2009 05:55 pm (UTC) - Expand
(Deleted comment)
Nov. 21st, 2009 05:16 pm (UTC)
I agree with you on the dialogue. Not a good script at all. Especially glaring when you consider how well put together last weeks script was.

ITA on the final Clois scene. And it struck me how much better present day Clois played then the future Clois, which seemed a little off to me.

For a long time now, this show has worked very hard to make Clark just one of the heroes instead of making him THE HERO. I don't think I've ever seen a show work so hard to drag their main character back into the pack rather then let him shine. Here, I would even argue that Chloe and Oliver were written to be bigger, better, tougher heroes then our shell of a Clark. And for some reason, they consider this good writing. But see, for me, Clark falling to pieces over someone is NEVER a positive for Clark. I don't care who it is. Because he should be, and I beleive is, stronger then that. But its not about showing Clark off to his best advantage. Here, it was about writing Lois as the center of his universe. It was about her, not so much him.

On a 2nd viewing, I do have to say that Tom and Callum Blue really play well off each other, and thats a definite plus. I never really thought Tom and Sam Witwer sparked much.

And you know I'm not a huge Lana fan, but frankly, I am beyond tired of everyone pretending there was no Lana, and there is no Lana.
(Deleted comment)
Nov. 21st, 2009 05:21 pm (UTC)
I just really expected this ep to rock, and it so didn't. In fact, aside from Roulette, I think this is the weakest ep of the season.

And YES! Chloe looks at Clark like he smells bad, and it not that different with Lois. And what was with the vitriol in her voice when she mentioned Clark sending Lois roses? She's just become so unpleasant to me.

And how about Clark apologizes when Chloe apologizes for her actions last season?

The sex scene was just so wrong. They needed a better set-up leading into it. They needed to slow down in the middle, so we could enjoy it. And they needed that beautiful aftermath that was in the leaked scene. What a freaking mess.

I don't want to talk spoilers, but the next 2 eps are Disciple (and Oliver-centric story), and then Warrior, which seems to have some significant Clois stuff in it. I don't know, I just don't know what to expect in terms of Lois.
(no subject) - svfan01 - Nov. 21st, 2009 06:12 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - jeannev - Nov. 21st, 2009 07:59 pm (UTC) - Expand
Nov. 21st, 2009 09:28 am (UTC)
You know, I haven't watched the episode yet and reading your post I don't know if I want to. No ofence to Lois fans, but I'm sick and tired of her having more screen time than Clark and I'm sick and tired of not knowing what role, if any, Clarks plays now in his own show other than being in love with her.

And I just can't stand the "it's all Clark's fault" thing another minute! People lie to him, betray him, hurt him and, in the end, it's all Clark's fault???!!!! Is that the only way those writers find to make a storyline be about him?

I want to see episodes that I can enjoy, or at least to not hate. I'm tired of hating the only show I'm unable to stop watching because of my love for the main character and actor. *sigh*
Nov. 21st, 2009 05:23 pm (UTC)
Up to now, this really has been Lois' show. And if some people are happy with that, I understand. I'm not judging. But it isn't really what I was hoping for, and its not really the reason I watch the show.

I understand how confusing and frustrating it can be to love a main character, and watch the show for them, but find the show was aggravating. I often find myself struggling with that in regards to SV too.
Nov. 21st, 2009 11:52 am (UTC)
Average screentime:

Clark- 17m, 54s
Chloe- 7m, 16s
Lois- 19m, 16s
Oliver- 12m, 19s
Tess- 6m, 52s
Zod- 8m, 5s

Is The Lois Lane Show finally over? I feel like I've woken up from a bad dream. No one other than Clark, not even my Chloe, should ever get over 30 minutes of ST in one episode (I'll make an exception for Onyx because of the 2 Lexes, but that's it).

Hopefully, now that she no longer has access to the memories from the future, her presence will be lessened in the coming weeks, so that they can start focusing on.... what's his name? The big dude who can run really fast and lift super heavy things with one finger and do other impossible things? The guy who was supposedly the star of this show?

All joking aside, this episode sucked for me except for FutureChloe. Way too many plot holes, and the end scene made me very uncomfortable.
Nov. 21st, 2009 05:26 pm (UTC)
I'm not sure any other character (other then Clark) has gotten such intensive focus over this sort of stretch of eps. I know that a lot of that has to do with shortchanging her over the last 2 seasons, them needing to play catch-up. But still, its a lot, and I do like Lois.

Hopefully, now that she no longer has access to the memories from the future, her presence will be lessened in the coming weeks, so that they can start focusing on.... what's his name? The big dude who can run really fast and lift super heavy things with one finger and do other impossible things? The guy who was supposedly the star of this show?

If this show has taught me anything over the last few seasons, its that I shouldn't hold my breath for this. Besides, with the guest star-arama they've got going, it doesn't seem to be in the cards.
(no subject) - svfan01 - Nov. 21st, 2009 06:15 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - jeannev - Nov. 21st, 2009 07:21 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - svfan01 - Nov. 21st, 2009 07:43 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - jeannev - Nov. 21st, 2009 08:01 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - svfan01 - Nov. 21st, 2009 11:24 pm (UTC) - Expand
Nov. 21st, 2009 03:12 pm (UTC)
I have to say that this is probably right up there with Doomsday for me because not too many things in this episode made sense. The screentime totals were yet another indication of how Clark is not the main character anymore on this show.

I have two huge problems with this episode and of course, they have to do with Clark. First of all, since when did Clark develop such a love for Lois that he would turn his back on everyone just because of her? "Doomsday" sucked and I admit that I only watched it once, but Jimmy being killed was something that Clark was bothered by, right? I mean in that last scene with Chlark, he was a topic that was talked about between the two before Clark left. So now this season, everything is all about Clark's feelings for Lois. Once again, I refer to the middle of season 8 when Clark was with Lana. So I guess 8 episodes later, less actually since Lois wasn't in every single one of those episodes, Clark has gone from not having any problem with Lois being away from him to a guy who can't even function anymore without her in his life. Clois has been a problem for me since the middle of season 8 but it just gets worse and worse as time has gone on because TPTB are not explaining anything about it. All they're doing is piling on more and more things that don't make sense and certainly don't match what happened in previous episodes/seasons. Par for the course with this show.

Clois aside, that's not even the worst of this episode for me. Let's start with future Clark. How in the world would future Clark allow Zod to build a tower that could create a red sun? He's the blur who monitors everything in Metropolis and yet he was clueless about that. What BS. But that's ok. Clark has a chance to change that, right? So the solution that TPTB come up with is for Clark to be friends with Zod? WTF? This destroys the entire season right there and spits on Clark's character this year. Let's review...the Zod tower is the problem. As long as it doesn't get built, Zod doesn't gain powers. So why does Clark have to be friends with Zod in order to prevent this from happening? Also, Zod might be a threat right now, but he's not a threat to Clark because 1) he doesn't know him, or at least he didn't prior to Clark revealing himself to him at the end of the episode(more on that little gem later) and 2)he doesn't have powers. Why can't Clark just go to Jor-El and find a way to lock his ass up in the phantom zone? This isn't like Davis either who was trying to be good. Zod is pure evil and has already started killing people. I know that I've always said that Clark should interact with ZOd more, but if being friends with him is the way to do that, no thanks. Plus, I'm sure Clark will find a way to mess up later this season and we'll all come back to the brilliant "Pandora" to realize when it all went wrong.

Finally, it really is amazing how the two main problems that I had with this episode can come together to create another massive problem. In the very same episode, all happening in the span of about 10 minutes, Clark decides to start a relationship with Lois even though he can't be honest with her and he also outs himself as the blur to Zod? That is so outrageous that I am at a loss for words. Now Zod can go after Lois the second that Clark does something that he doesn't agree with in order to threaten him. My god, this is not a mistake that season 9 Clark should be making. Season 1 Clark wouldn't even do this. He wouldn't start a relationship with the girl if he felt that she could be in danger and he certainly wouldn't announce to his enemies that he has powers. Sorry for the long post but this episode was atrocious. I'm trying to find ways to like the show and even defend Clark with the decisions that he makes but TPTB are making it impossible for me to do so.
Nov. 21st, 2009 03:16 pm (UTC)
(no subject) - jeannev - Nov. 21st, 2009 07:32 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - (Anonymous) - Nov. 21st, 2009 08:16 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - jeannev - Nov. 22nd, 2009 04:12 am (UTC) - Expand
Nov. 21st, 2009 03:27 pm (UTC)
Wow. I haven't watch the episode yet but reading your review and a few others on TWU doesn't make me want to watch it. I'm in the same place as Carolandtom.
//Talk about a big fizzle with the Clark/Alia thing, eh? Why did she apologize to him for failing, and why did she touch his face tenderly in Savior? They apparently had no relationship to speak of. I smell a rewrite.//
Of course. Clark belongs to Lois now, so imo, he's not allowed to have a significant relationship with any other female. And maybe that's why the Chlark relationship sucks so much now. And God knows that someone apologizing to Clark certainly doesn't fit the pattern right?
Nov. 21st, 2009 07:34 pm (UTC)
Oh, you should watch it. For one thing, you may feel differently. And for another, Tom is beautiful!

I had hoped that there were some kind of meaningful interaction there between Clark and Alia. But, oh well, guess not.

And the Chlark is a big unpleasant mess.
Nov. 21st, 2009 04:13 pm (UTC)
I watched the episode. Ugh! So much wrong in it I wouldn't even know where to start! And I fear things are even going to get worse in future episodes. These writers and producers have no love or respect for Clark/Superman. It's outrageous!

Right now, I can only pray SV ends soon so that I can spare myself the pain of seeing a character I've loved for so many years being destroyed like this.
Nov. 21st, 2009 07:35 pm (UTC)
I can't say the spoilers we have for future eps fill me with confidence, no. :(

I know I'd be fine with S9 being the last, though I'm really going to miss Tom on my screen on a weekly basis.
Nov. 21st, 2009 06:44 pm (UTC)
Excellent questions, all of them! This should have been an action packed episode but it felt so static, just a succession of characters talking in rooms. It also felt like a wasted chance to show that Clark is a hero, even without his powers. Once again, he's practically a bystander.

Who directed this ep?
Morgan Beggs - he's been assistant director on a number of SV episodes, but his only other solo credit is "Bulletproof."

Clark turned his back on Chloe and Oliver because they reminded him of Lois? Not because one stabbed him in the back symbolically, and the other one did it literally?
It was the perfect opportunity to deal with last season's betrayals...and they botch it to re-enforce a relationship which is already obvious.

I just can't work up any energy for this one - the one scene I liked was Zod dragging Clark along by the foot. (Poor Tom!) In style and pacing, it felt very similar to Doomsday which is a bad thing. "Bride" was a much better episode on which to go to hiatus.
Nov. 21st, 2009 07:39 pm (UTC)
This should have been an action packed episode but it felt so static, just a succession of characters talking in rooms. It also felt like a wasted chance to show that Clark is a hero, even without his powers. Once again, he's practically a bystander.

YES to all of this.

God, the editing on this ep was horrendous. I don't always notice editing, but I couldn't avoid it on this one. Some scenes went on too long (Tess death scene, the Tess/Stuart scenes), and some scenes were too short (the love scene, the Clark/Zod stuff).

I don't know why Marshall or Winter, or some director with some experiance with SV, didn't have the reigns on this one.

I'm convinced they are just going to ignore anything Oliver and Chloe did in Doomsday. According to the show, they did nothing wrong, but Clark did! End of story. Assholes!

I was so disappointed that we just cut to Zod dragging Clark by the foot. When did he confront him? How did that happen? I wanted to see that! And I realize we couldn't see it because Lois didn't see it. Which was just freaking frustrating.

I agree that Bride was a much better mid-season cliffhanger. Though the last Clark/Zod scene was pretty well done.
Nov. 21st, 2009 07:00 pm (UTC)
I'm definitely going to rewatch, but my immediate feeling was disappointment. From their going the cheap route and just repurposing the Clark/Lois sex scenes from the previous clips, to the bad CGI to Clark taking blame to Clark has somehow become the follower, but not the leader to this taking care of Zod business to all the plot holes you listed. It all just bothered me.
Nov. 21st, 2009 07:41 pm (UTC)
I swear, I've never wanted to hug my flist as tight as I do today, because really, I was beginning to think I saw a whole different show from some people. I can't believe the praise this one is getting from some. I respect it, of course. But I'm just confused.

I felt bothered by this one too. I think thats a good word to use.
(Deleted comment)
Nov. 21st, 2009 07:45 pm (UTC)
Yeah, Stuart is alive. But WTF with Tess just shooting him in the back? That seemed irrational and extreme to me.

I really think TPTB try to come up with ways to make Clark look weak, when they really should be all about highlighting all the ways he's strong and inspirational. Its so confusing to me.

I have no problem with Clois. I have a problem with Clois being Clark's A #1 plotline, and it has been thus far. Will that change now? We'll see.

Chloe and Oliver are, right now, 2 characters that are used terribly in relation to Clark. Thats pretty much the bottom line.
Nov. 21st, 2009 07:35 pm (UTC)
I hated it. Hated the way Clark was written. Hated that the writers seemed hell bent on regressing him. And hated that they've set up an almost identical situation as the Clark / Davis one from last season, wrt Clark making the wrong decision / stance.
Nov. 21st, 2009 07:46 pm (UTC)
I was really wondering how you'd feel about it. I figured we'd be on the same page, but I wasn't sure.

What can I say? ITA with you. It doesn't bode well. Not even a little.
Nov. 21st, 2009 11:42 pm (UTC)
I can see where those who hate this episode due to the writing for the characters are coming from. I had a a few 'Huh?' and a couple of WTF moments myself and thought some of the editing was choppy. But I was still really entertained by the episode, even moreso than Idol, actually, due to the epic, end-of-the-world scenario which I find intriguing.

The self-blame that seems embedded in Clark now just tends to go in one ear and out the other with me these days. And as for this befriending of Zod issue, I'll just wait and see where they take it; even if they repeat their mistakes from the past and take it in the 'Clark's wrong again' direction, I'm at the point where I won't be jeering so much as just ignoring it.
Nov. 21st, 2009 11:47 pm (UTC)
Oh, forgot to say that, unlike last week where I felt Clark was in the episode less than his screen time totals said otherwise, your screen time totals for Clark and my gut feeling match up better for Pandora. It felt to me like he had a greater on-screen presence this week.
(no subject) - jeannev - Nov. 22nd, 2009 04:09 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - svfan01 - Nov. 22nd, 2009 07:50 am (UTC) - Expand
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